SMBC Comics Forum

[quote="NumberFourtyThree"]When you factor in how the way technology uses energy is in most cases never 100% efficient, any laser powered by Superman's arms cranking a generator will be less powerful than Superman's punch. That laser isn't going to defeat Darkseid.[/quote]
Well not with one shot no. We're not talking about a 1 on 1 fight though. We're talking about a war. [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdDdHMwhU2s&t=1m45s]The thousand nations[/url] of the earthian empire would descend upon him. Our lasers would blot out the sun.

Plus keep in mind the applications of energy in combat aren't limited to lasers. We could have all manner of cutting and shooting devices. Plus while the energy use would be less efficient, the laser could use more energy and focus it on a smaller point creating a much more destructive shot than superman's punch.

Plus unlike superman, the generator would be capable of protecting all of earth at once. While superman can only be in one place at a time the generator would arm every human soldier with cutting edge weaponry capable of defending against darkseid's mighty armies.

Then we factor in energy storage. All the excess energy that superman provides during peaceful years would presumably be kept in batteries for when it was needed.

As a whole the generator would be a much more versatile tool than superman himself is. We could tailor it to our needs at the moment. There'd be no reason for the generator to rely on simple head to head 1 on 1 brute force in the battle against darkseid. The notions of going punch for punch with darkseid doesn't really exist with the generator, though I suppose if we desperately wanted to we could use it to fuel a power suit which would require more energy to do the same as superman but perhaps utilize it in more clever ways than his alien physiology and waste less on things not needed for combat and give it to an actual combat expert rather than a farmboy, and then I guess we could supercharge it with some of those peace batteries if it still wasn't up to the task. Though why you'd want to put all your eggs in one basket like that is beyond me.

Edit: I also feel the need to point out that force isn't even necessarily needed to defeat darkseid. Need I point out that in The Justice League Unlimited Lex Luthor defeated Darkseid using only his wit? Well wit and an alien with deus ex machina running through his veins willing to teleport Luthor to the edge of the universe, but mostly wit.

When you factor in how the way technology uses energy is in most cases never 100% efficient, any laser powered by Superman's arms cranking a generator will be less powerful than Superman's punch. That laser isn't going to defeat Darkseid.

[quote="Edminster"][quote="Gangler"]I'm entirely in agreement with Luthor on that one.[/quote]
You've never read All-Star Superman, have you? It pretty handily refutes this.[/quote]

How so?

[quote="Edminster"]
You've never read All-Star Superman, have you?[/quote]
I have not. Truth be told I actually just pick up a superman comic once in a while when I see something's going on with Lex. Not really a fan of the rest of all that.

[quote="Gangler"]I'm entirely in agreement with Luthor on that one.[/quote]
You've never read All-Star Superman, have you? It pretty handily refutes this.

[quote="NumberFourtyThree"]Also to bring up another issue, in the comics Superman didn't just save relatively small groups of people, on a number of occasion he prevented something from destroying the world entirely. He couldn't do that if society would collapse when he stopped cranking the generator.[/quote]
See, this has always been my biggest beef with Superman. He weakens the human race. We'd been getting along for how long without him and then he comes along and suddenly every time there's a threat to the world we need the kryptonian to deal with it. He breeds dependency.

You know what would have happened if Darkseid came along when there was no superman? We would have fought a war, stolen their tech, improved upon it, and then actually finished the job by bringing Darkseid's head on a pike to be displayed for the countrymen and earned ourselves a planet full of resources to harvest and cheap labor which would be easily accessible since we'd have mastered the boom tube tech.

The boom tubes would then be used in our intergalactic crusades as we conquered planet after planet, reverse engineering the power ring to create a variant of our own which would work from a more efficient fuel source than the emotional spectrum. Like perhaps the life force of our conquered races or something. Who knows? Take down the green lantern corp and rule the universe unopposed.

When Superman flies he binds man to the ground. I'm entirely in agreement with Luthor on that one. And yeah, if Superman was running the generator that might ease the process a little.

[quote="NumberFourtyThree"]It's not just a matter of large threats coming from outer space. He has stopped villains on the Earths surface whose plans could have somehow destroyed the world, and even beings on other planets who threatened to unmake reality itself. In many cases a giant laser would not be able to substitute for his heroics.[/quote]

I'm pretty sure that it's already been pretty clearly established in this thread that if you got rid of poverty and energy needs there would be no more violence or crime, ergo, the only threat the world need actually worry about are ones from outer space.*

*[size=74]I'm helping![/size]

A large enough laser is always adequate substitute for heroics.

It's not just a matter of large threats coming from outer space. He has stopped villains on the Earths surface whose plans could have somehow destroyed the world, and even beings on other planets who threatened to unmake reality itself. In many cases a giant laser would not be able to substitute for his heroics.

With enough energy, they don't need superman's powers. They can laser that muthafukin asteroid headed for earth.

Also to bring up another issue, in the comics Superman didn't just save relatively small groups of people, on a number of occasion he prevented something from destroying the world entirely. He couldn't do that if society would collapse when he stopped cranking the generator.

Touching on the comic for this day, I thought I'd say that the last bit with the thief keeping her mask warm with his face is one of the best bits I've seen for awhile.

Native Americans rarely actually wiped out entire tribes. There were usually survivors who just ended up getting absorbed into other tribes. A good example of this is the Huron and the Iroquois. History books often tell you the Iroquois wiped out the entire Huron nation, except for the fact that they're still around and have since reformed back into their own nation.

Not really entirely caught up on the debate, I just like talking about Canadian history when I get the chance.

So basically you guys are saying we need to produce more hentai games featuring western characters. I think you're on to something.

[quote="NumberFourtyThree"]There were fights that were mostly ritualistic with few casualties like you describe in some tribal societies, but there were in other cases real wars with extermination of some other tribe as the goal and sometimes result. I looked up a number of different articles on such subjects recently, but I haven't been saving the links and some of what I read disagreed with other sources on many points. In any case, you can find an example of one such battle here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Hingakaka with unusual detail on the matter since it happened shortly after Europeans made contact with natives of New Zealand (though Europeans weren't directly involved, to the point the year of the battle is uncertain). In any case large scale warfare could only occur once sufficient population density was achieved, but there was small scale violence much earlier, as many prehistoric remains were obviously killed with a weapon.
[/quote] My disagreement was not that it did not ever happen, rather I presented tribal locations where it was known to happen from time to time. My contention was with the word "often". Tribal battles would often NOT result in the wiping out of an entire tribe. It did happen, but the wiped out tribe would have to have seriously messed something up.

That being said, I am primarily knowledgeable in Native American tribes and a number of Middle Eastern tribes (heavily focusing on Jewish and Muslim tribes). That is to say, I know almost nothing about islanders and several African tribes (Zulu excluded because they're awesome). I was taught that the absolute wiping out of a tribe was a rare event that could not possibly be categorized as the common outcome of a battle. Note that single battles often decided the winning side of their conflicts and so were most often the entire "war". As such, these miniature wars rarely warranted mention (especially since writing wasn't well preserved and oral tradition has to be important enough to remember, such as the wiping out a tribe). Any information to the contrary of this would be genuinely appreciated and could only serve to better educate me on this.