[2014-12-30] Dollar Auction

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Expand view Topic review: [2014-12-30] Dollar Auction

Re: [2014-12-30] Dollar Auction

Post by Lethal Interjection » Fri Oct 16, 2015 9:17 pm

Sahan wrote:Actually, I've found out a way to create my own sighs at no cost to myself. I'm gonna be rich!


Oh man, this is a great idea. If I can manage to market my coworkers' sighs I will have an untold abundance of cash inflow.

Re: [2014-12-30] Dollar Auction

Post by Liriodendron_fagotti » Thu Oct 15, 2015 1:28 pm

Sahan wrote:Actually, I've found out a way to create my own sighs at no cost to myself. I'm gonna be rich!

Every breath you take increases your oxidative stress, bringing you closer to death. To offset this, simply reduce your food intake by half!

Re: [2014-12-30] Dollar Auction

Post by Sahan » Thu Oct 15, 2015 1:26 pm

Actually, I've found out a way to create my own sighs at no cost to myself. I'm gonna be rich!

Re: [2014-12-30] Dollar Auction

Post by a1s » Wed Oct 14, 2015 3:32 pm

Hey, Sahan, if you give me 94 cents, I will bid $1.80, thus freeing you from paying (as the 3rd runner up)

Re: [2014-12-30] Dollar Auction

Post by Lethal Interjection » Fri Oct 09, 2015 11:36 pm

95.1 cents!

Re: [2014-12-30] Dollar Auction

Post by Sahan » Thu Oct 08, 2015 11:18 am

I'll buy your sigh for 95 cents!

Re: [2014-12-30] Dollar Auction

Post by Apocalyptus » Wed Oct 07, 2015 6:54 am

Sigh

Re: [2014-12-30] Dollar Auction

Post by Guest » Sat Oct 03, 2015 6:14 pm

a1s wrote:@guest.
The Wikipedia article does not support your view ... here: http://www.heretical.com/pound/dollar.html

Do you read your own links? It says right there that the game is not rational, "best time is during a party when ... the propensity to calculate does not settle in" and that the game models addiction (which is anything but rational.) The winning move is still not to play (well, ok, this part it doesn't say, but it's implied).

Re: [2014-12-30] Dollar Auction

Post by mountainmage » Sat Oct 03, 2015 4:11 am

Liriodendron_fagotti wrote:This is the worst thread on this forum.


I'm sure if you dug deep enough you'd find one worse. I'm positive, because I've lived through many a shitty thread.

Re: [2014-12-30] Dollar Auction

Post by DonRetrasado » Fri Oct 02, 2015 11:31 pm

Liriodendron_fagotti wrote:This is the worst thread on this forum.

And yet we gawk at it like a car crash while our incompetent mods turn a blind eye!

Re: [2014-12-30] Dollar Auction

Post by Liriodendron_fagotti » Fri Oct 02, 2015 11:21 pm

This is the worst thread on this forum.

Re: [2014-12-30] Dollar Auction

Post by Lethal Interjection » Fri Oct 02, 2015 8:42 pm

a1s wrote:You can't just make up rules on the spot to win arguments. This isn't Calvinball :lol:


But the internet is basically Calvinball, isn't it?

Re: [2014-12-30] Dollar Auction

Post by a1s » Fri Oct 02, 2015 5:24 pm

@guest.
The Wikipedia article does not support your view (I think they'd mention if it was a poker game :roll: ). You can't just make up rules on the spot to win arguments. This isn't Calvinball :lol:
Fake edit: in fact, here: http://www.heretical.com/pound/dollar.html
1. (As in any auction) the dollar bill goes to the highest bidder, who pays whatever the high bid was. Each new bid has to be higher than the current high bid, and the game ends when there is no new bid within a specified time limit.
2. (Unlike at Sotheby’s!) the second-highest bidder also has to pay the amount of his last bid – and gets nothing in return. You really don’t want to be the second-highest bidder.
(In case you didn't catch that- it's from an actual, published, book by someone who actually knows something) :geek:

Re: [2014-12-30] Dollar Auction

Post by Guest » Fri Oct 02, 2015 5:10 pm

mrjones wrote:Imagine you are a rational player faced with a player whom you cannot assume to be rational. The 'correct strategy' (assuming a rational opponent) would be to bid 60 cents.

It would be, but that's an illegal play. Shubik's Dollar Auction actually works more like a poker game, you can either "raise 5 cents" or "fold" (you can't "check" however, nor does raising increase the ante). That however doesn't change the fact that a game between rational opponents, the winning move is, in the immortal words of Joshua the NORAD Computer, not to play.

Re: [2014-12-30] Dollar Auction

Post by mrjones » Thu Oct 01, 2015 12:57 pm

Guest wrote:
mrjones wrote:
mrjones wrote:Before accepting the Wikipedia article as a source, at least look at the talk page. The top post there in particular.

The claim in the comic was that 'rational choices can lead to irrational behavior' ... Rationality can be defined precisely, and when the rules of the game are defined precisely you can work out how a rational being would act (as is done in the article).

If you take that view, then the claim becomes a contradiction in terms (like "four sided triangle",) rather then merely false, since in context of Game Theory, "behavior" and (series of) "choices" are synonyms. Your defeat of strawman arguments, while valiant, brings no new insight.
It's clear from context, that we can only assume one player to be rational (even that is a bit of a stretch, given their depicted actions, but let's take it at face value) while the rest are the flawed human animal we know and love. And that it leads to a string of decisions that, in hindsight, appear irrational.[/quote]

Yes, like I said the claim is self-contradictory. But, no, the escalation of bids is not not rational in any scenario.

Imagine you are a rational player faced with a player whom you cannot assume to be rational. The 'correct strategy' (assuming a rational opponent) would be to bid 60 cents, at which point the auction would end. However, you don't know that your opponent is rational, so are you being rational in bidding 60 cents? Probably not. In any case, if you do bid, and your opponent raises, clearly it is now foolish (irrational) to keep escalating. You have no reason to believe that your opponent won't keep raising. After the bids have escalated far enough, claiming that continued escalation is rational (This claim IS MADE in the comic and on the Wikipedia page [but not by Shubik or O'Neill]. This is not a strawman argument) is completely ridiculous.

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