Death Penalty

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Death Penalty

Postby astasia » Wed Apr 01, 2009 10:59 am

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/stor ... =102570588

"Opponents Focus on Cost in Death Penalty Debate."

Doesn't it seem a little cynical? It is a good argument, but, honestly, it being too expensive to kill people is why we shouldn't? Isn't there something wrong with a society who thinks that way?
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Re: Death Penalty

Postby AHMETxRock » Wed Apr 01, 2009 11:17 am

There is DEFINATELY something wrong with the country. That's just one of them.
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Re: Death Penalty

Postby rustypup » Wed Apr 01, 2009 11:29 am

If you divide the overall cost by the number of actual executions, Dieter says, the death penalty is very expensive.
- It's only "expensive" because of the delay between sentencing and execution... if there were no gap, there would be no basis for this argument...

@astasia: I take it from your comments that you disapprove of the death penalty?
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Re: Death Penalty

Postby Avalant » Wed Apr 01, 2009 1:45 pm

The death penalty in this country is not only inefficient but also cruel. Having someone waiting to die for months on end is (in my opinion) far worse than just taking them out behind a shed and shooting them in the head.

If this topic interests you, I suggest you read The Chamber by John Grisham, it's a deep (and very depressing) look into death row and how the death penalty works in the USA (well, in most of the states who still practice it anyway). The amount of red tape surrounding this practice is astounding, and after reading the book and doing some research on my own I decided that the process either needs to be streamlined or eliminated altogether.
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Re: Death Penalty

Postby AHMETxRock » Wed Apr 01, 2009 1:52 pm

Trust me, the prisoners tend to want the extended waiting period. They can live almost 10-20 years longer due to the process.

Guys, put yourself in that electrical chair for a moment. Don't think I'm advocating terrorism, because I'm not, but I've been placed under suspicion and people have attempted to punish me and my family for crimes we did not commit, and the fear against Muslims was so great that we had to hide from the public eye for the first two years to not get harrassed.

SO QUIT FUCKING SAYING LET'S KILL THEM BITCHES BECAUSE THEY DESERVE IT. YOU DON'T KNOW THAT, AND YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO DECIDE THAT. GO TO HELL YOURSELVES.

Ahem, yes. It's not that easy to simply throw a person's life away. I don't know how many of you death sentence supporters would be able to pull the switch, staring into the eyes of a man about to die. All his pain, hatred, regret, and fear. Focused into a single moment and directed directly at you. Seriously, I don't want to ever meet you if you could do it.
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Re: Death Penalty

Postby rustypup » Wed Apr 01, 2009 2:03 pm

AHMETxRock wrote:YOU DON'T KNOW THAT, AND YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO DECIDE THAT. GO TO HELL YOURSELVES.
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AHMETxRock wrote:I don't want to ever meet you if you could do it.
Speaking as someone who lives in a relatively violent society, I can assure you that the lack of recourse to this solution does far more harm than the minuscule number of erroneous executions.

I would agree that the time-lag between sentence and execution is ridiculous.
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Re: Death Penalty

Postby Sahan » Wed Apr 01, 2009 2:12 pm

Yes I heard about this. It was mentioned in a comedy TV game show that focuses on current news events. Afterwards, the host put on a cheesy grin, swung his fist and said "Only in America, folks" or something to that effect. You guys cease to suprise us with your crazy antics nowadays.

But hey, the miscarriage of justice clearly isn't a big enough deterrent for you peeps. At least when we get a guy wrongly sentenced for murder he gets to live a pardoned life after 12 years,with compensationyou lucky guys get the liberty of saying "Whoops, sorry!" and shrugging your shoulders. As long as you start thinking about your flawed justice system for whatever reason, I'm happy.
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Re: Death Penalty

Postby smiley_cow » Wed Apr 01, 2009 2:16 pm

I'm against the death penalty. I just don't think anyone has the right to take lives, the government included. And maybe in the United States it's only for extreme crimes and when there is no doubt of their guilt or whatever, but places like Thailand you can be executed for drug trafficking, in China you can be executed for tax evasion and a friend linked me this little gem yesterday. And actually if I'm not mistaken even the United States allows for the death penalty to be given out for drug related offensives, not just murders.

I guess what I'm trying to say is, what makes someone's life worthless? Where do we draw the line between those of us that are apparently worthy of our lives, and those that aren't. I guess I just feel that just because someone does a bad thing doesn't make them a bad person, and while I agree that certain actions should have certain consequences, to me the death penalty is just too extreme.
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Re: Death Penalty

Postby Sahan » Wed Apr 01, 2009 2:24 pm

If there is a scene where I accept the death penalty, it's drug trafficking, because you can get caught red-handed for that offence . 9 Australians faced Death Row in 2006 in Indonesia for this, and I don't feel any sympathy for them. Drugs take way too many lives, selling them is a selfish act.

EDIT:'Selfless' changed to 'shellfish'
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Re: Death Penalty

Postby Avalant » Wed Apr 01, 2009 2:28 pm

AHMETxRock wrote:Trust me, the prisoners tend to want the extended waiting period. They can live almost 10-20 years longer due to the process.

This depends on a lot of factors. If there is no chance of them escaping the death sentence the waiting period is worse. If you still have hope, then it's a bit different. Also each prisoner will feel differently about their sentence, some may not even fear death. Each method of execution has a different effect on your psyche too.

I live in Boston, where there is no death penalty, and I can't really say whether I support it or not. It's easy to read about someone doing something horrible and think to yourself "OH MAN THEY SHOULD KILL THAT MOTHERFUCKER" but it's completely different in practice.
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Re: Death Penalty

Postby rustypup » Wed Apr 01, 2009 2:59 pm

smiley_cow wrote: what makes someone's life worthless?
When someone decides to take another's life in anger, for money, or whatever reason, their life is forfeit. Simply put, by doing so, they are electively choosing to discard any rights or protections they enjoyed in society.

I see no reason to lament the loss of a life which has devolved to that level of anti-social behaviour. What makes their life more valuable than their victim's?

How many victims would it take before the death penalty is considered a viable solution?
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Re: Death Penalty

Postby Oldrac the Chitinous » Wed Apr 01, 2009 3:05 pm

rustypup wrote:
If you divide the overall cost by the number of actual executions, Dieter says, the death penalty is very expensive.
It's only "expensive" because of the delay between sentencing and execution... if there were no gap, there would be no basis for this argument...
Surely you're not suggesting that we deny people sentenced to die the right to appeal their convictions?

The way I see it is, if someone's been locked away in jail for the rest of their life, with no hope of parole, they're no threat to anybody anymore. So by executing them, there's one more person dead than there needs to be. And I'd just as soon not have that blood on my hands.
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Re: Death Penalty

Postby AHMETxRock » Wed Apr 01, 2009 3:33 pm

It's less expensive to educate these criminals rather than imprison them for life.
Most are from low income families, from bad neighborhoods with bad schools.
Statistically, that is.

The death penalty is meant to deter crime. We currently attempt to discourage crime, but most criminals are people that have been pushed into a corner. They don't care about your precious laws. The laws protect you from harm but have done nothing to stop the harm that has happened to them already. We're not going to help them need to not commit crime, we only punish them for imposing on our ability to enjoy our pleasures.

Killing criminals is not effective. There is very little evidence that the death sentence prevents criminals from breaking the law. Most people that break the law don't accept the punishments, they're forced to. A criminal will do what they want until they're caught, regardless of the punishment. It's already too late. Prison is meant to reform the civilian, like rehab is meant to kick people off of addictions.

So forget whether or not it is even justified, because Islam states that a murderer deserves the death sentence. I'm not going to yell JESUS LOVES YOU! and throw bibles at you. The death sentence doesn't even fricken work.
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Re: Death Penalty

Postby mountainmage » Wed Apr 01, 2009 3:41 pm

Ahmet, I have no idea where you got terrorism out of this, we weren't even talking about them. Now I can see why you're always so touchy about the whole muslim bigotry after 9/11.

Anyways, I'm for the death penalty. It's one of the few conservative views I have. If you commit heinous crimes you don't deserve to live. If someone in your family was brutally murdered for no reason, you'd change your tune right quick, unless you're the most forgiving person on the planet.
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Re: Death Penalty

Postby LordRetard » Wed Apr 01, 2009 4:55 pm

Death penalty is actually cheaper, I'd think, than keeping someone incarcerated for 20 or so years. All we need to do now is get rid of that pesky delay period! This will have NO CONSEQUENCES.
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