[2014-04-07] I yam what I yam

Blame Quintushalls for this.

Moderator: Kimra

Re: [2014-04-07] I yam what I yam

Postby smiley_cow » Tue Apr 08, 2014 1:40 pm

Liriodendron_fagotti wrote:I think it's because this is a comic that made people laugh at spousal abuse, various family-cides, Hitler jokes, etc.

Athe forbid he return to making offensive jokes, even if that wasn't his intent.


People were bothered by a thing. They have that right. It wasn't even funny (which is my personal offensive rule. If you're going to be horrible and offensive, you have to at least be funny about it.) or interesting, or anything. It was just a random dude, randomly bemoaning boobs.

I'm not really sure why people are so bothered by this. Or so eager to defend this rather crappy comic.
DonRetrasado wrote:Is a man not entitled to the sweat of his brow? I chose something different. I chose the impossible. I chose... Bitcoin.
User avatar
smiley_cow
polite but murderous
 
Posts: 6518
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2009 6:15 pm
Location: The vast and desolate prairies

Re: [2014-04-07] I yam what I yam

Postby Kimra » Tue Apr 08, 2014 1:43 pm

He wasn't random. That was totally Popeye.
King Prawn
User avatar
Kimra
He-Man in a Miniskirt
 
Posts: 6872
Joined: Tue Jun 02, 2009 10:18 am
Location: meanwhile elsewhere

Re: [2014-04-07] I yam what I yam

Postby smiley_cow » Tue Apr 08, 2014 1:46 pm

Kimra wrote:He wasn't random. That was totally Popeye.


I mean random in the sense that there wasn't any real rhyme or reason past 'hey, this is a dark way to interpret a children's character'. I wanted to reply to this with a joke answer but I couldn't think of anything. =(
DonRetrasado wrote:Is a man not entitled to the sweat of his brow? I chose something different. I chose the impossible. I chose... Bitcoin.
User avatar
smiley_cow
polite but murderous
 
Posts: 6518
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2009 6:15 pm
Location: The vast and desolate prairies

Re: [2014-04-07] I yam what I yam

Postby Kimra » Tue Apr 08, 2014 1:48 pm

smiley_cow wrote:I wanted to reply to this with a joke answer but I couldn't think of anything. =(

I'll try and write a better set up next time. This was totally my fault.
King Prawn
User avatar
Kimra
He-Man in a Miniskirt
 
Posts: 6872
Joined: Tue Jun 02, 2009 10:18 am
Location: meanwhile elsewhere

Re: [2014-04-07] I yam what I yam

Postby Michele-Michel » Tue Apr 08, 2014 1:57 pm

smiley_cow wrote:
Liriodendron_fagotti wrote:I think it's because this is a comic that made people laugh at spousal abuse, various family-cides, Hitler jokes, etc.

Athe forbid he return to making offensive jokes, even if that wasn't his intent.


People were bothered by a thing. They have that right. It wasn't even funny (which is my personal offensive rule. If you're going to be horrible and offensive, you have to at least be funny about it.) or interesting, or anything. It was just a random dude, randomly bemoaning boobs.

I'm not really sure why people are so bothered by this. Or so eager to defend this rather crappy comic.


People tend to be wrapped up in their own experience, especially if they're the majority. I have to second guess at points when something doesn't directly affect my life to decide whether or not I'm legitimately upset, or whether or not I'm just worried it's going to spoil my fun (which is at the expense of another).

I've gotten over throwing things at the TV with the latest ambulance chaser ad regarding Risperdal's link to gynecomastia and lactation (even if they're really REALLY gross).

Honestly cis-people whining like this are important in opening up the realization that people are so psychologically tied to their gender that it does warrant counselling and surgery as being very medically necessary. Even if it was a sort of "puberty" due to an "artificial" substance or side effect of another drug. It could be a foot in the door, even if it takes the fact that cis-peeps are harmed by it too to get there rather than it being that we should treat transgender people as people too. Sometimes you can only see an issue if it affects you too.

That's what I took away from it anyway.
User avatar
Michele-Michel
 
Posts: 21
Joined: Mon Apr 07, 2014 1:11 pm
Location: Here

Re: [2014-04-07] I yam what I yam

Postby Edminster » Tue Apr 08, 2014 2:02 pm

herecomesdrtrans wrote:Trans guy here. Very much appreciated the note on it, but seeing a joke about a man being very distressed about having female breasts at the beginning of my day just made me sad instead of giving me my usual SMBC-induced chuckle and smile. I don't really need anything "done," just thought I'd mention it. Maybe I'm too sensitive, but sometimes the small things add up.


This post here? This is a very good post. It is not decrying Zach as insensitive to the plight of trans* people at all but simply pointing out that they, too, empathize with the plight of Popeye and through this are less able to laugh about the comic qua comic. Just as a person whose family was actually murdered by lobsters would have a difficult time laughing about this installment, hcdt cannot easily chuckle about the juxtaposition of reality injected into a classic cartoon.

Further, there is no demand for redress of grievances but simply a wish to note for the record their feelings. This is important for many reasons not least of which is letting other minority voices who may believe themselves alone know that indeed they are not, that there is a kindred soul also out there in the aether who feels as they do and that they should not be afraid to simply exist.

Finally, hcdt acknowledges that there is a vast continuum of ability in putting up with bullshit and that they may fall below the mean in said ability, but also acknowledges that this sort of thing is real and does hurt. There is no judgement here, no condemnation, but most importantly there is no request for outside opinion on their abilities.

Everything past hcdt's post is idiocy and blather over who can be offended more: those who take offense to people taking offense or those taking offense to people taking offense to people taking offense. I am ashamed of all of you for not taking a step back and seeing this. You are all smarter than this and have perhaps spent too long fighting individual battles on the redditfields of the tumblrwars to see the larger picture.

e:
Michele-Michel wrote:Honestly cis-people whining like this are important in opening up the realization that people are so psychologically tied to their gender that it does warrant counselling and surgery as being very medically necessary. Even if it was a sort of "puberty" due to an "artificial" substance or side effect of another drug. It could be a foot in the door, even if it takes the fact that cis-peeps are harmed by it too to get there rather than it being that we should treat transgender people as people too. Sometimes you can only see an issue if it affects you too.


this is also a good post and contains the perspective i briefly mentioned
ol qwerty bastard wrote:bitcoin is backed by math, and math is intrinsically perfect and logically consistent always

gödel stop spreading fud
User avatar
Edminster
Tested positive for Space-AIDS
 
Posts: 8836
Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2005 9:53 pm
Location: Internet

Re: [2014-04-07] I yam what I yam

Postby DonRetrasado » Tue Apr 08, 2014 2:19 pm

I don't really know much about gender dysphoria and I don't really have anything to say about it, but I believe in free speech, and part of that is accepting that people are gonna get offended at things I like (or do not like). If anything I don't like Zach's continuing tendency to hamfist that comment of "look how sensitive I am!" into his newsblog thing, but even then I'm not really that upset at it, that's just how he is.

It's strange for someone to push that free speech agenda of "I have the right to comment on whatever thing I don't know about", and then when someone criticizes them they go "how DARE you!!" Duh, that's how free speech works. You can say what you want, but you're still kind of an asshole.

smiley_cow wrote:People were bothered by a thing. They have that right. It wasn't even funny (which is my personal offensive rule. If you're going to be horrible and offensive, you have to at least be funny about it.) or interesting, or anything. It was just a random dude, randomly bemoaning boobs.

I'm not really sure why people are so bothered by this. Or so eager to defend this rather crappy comic.


Edminster wrote:there is no demand for redress of grievances but simply a wish to note for the record their feelings. This is important for many reasons not least of which is letting other minority voices who may believe themselves alone know that indeed they are not, that there is a kindred soul also out there in the aether who feels as they do and that they should not be afraid to simply exist.


EDIT: Mostly I'm reiterating what other people already said, but in clumsier words.
Astrogirl wrote:Lethal, nobody wants to know about your herpes.

Lethal Interjection wrote:That's good to know. I can avoid a few awkward phone calls now.
User avatar
DonRetrasado
los más retrasadadados
 
Posts: 2845
Joined: Tue Aug 31, 2010 6:27 am
Location: ¡Canada!

Re: [2014-04-07] I yam what I yam

Postby GUTCHUCKER » Tue Apr 08, 2014 5:08 pm

I regret making the shit comment. I don't really know why I said it, sorry.
As for everything else: okay, I see now.
Datanazush wrote:I ship Mohammed and Jehova.
User avatar
GUTCHUCKER
Gotchucker's less handsome twin
 
Posts: 2124
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 2:26 am
Location: Paradise City?

Re: [2014-04-07] I yam what I yam

Postby Peon » Wed Apr 09, 2014 4:24 pm

This board is getting meta as fuck
Ask the next question.
User avatar
Peon
 
Posts: 96
Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2012 8:12 pm

Re: [2014-04-07] I yam what I yam

Postby TheAls » Fri Apr 11, 2014 8:09 am

Kimra wrote:The fact is: No-one has the right to tell you reasons.


Aaand you're wrong. Anyone has the right to tell you virtually anything.

Unfortunately, it's on each individual to react to things in a manner that they think will best advance their personal beliefs and goals.

If your reaction to something you want people not to do is to tell them they "can't do it," then you've already failed at that particular effort. Because they did. And can. And will.

It's not about making people wrong; that only forces them to defend and reinforce their own beliefs. It's about inviting them to consider other ideas. And if they don't, well, that's their right too.

It's not a sprint, it's a marathon. Social norms don't change overnight, and usually neither do individuals. Water the seed of doubt, but try to understand when it doesn't sprout immediately.
TheAls
 

Re: [2014-04-07] I yam what I yam

Postby lunardreams » Mon Apr 14, 2014 12:19 am

Trans guy here. I appreciated Zach's comment that no offense was meant. I also found the comic to be rather funny, in a very dark sort of way, as many of my favorite SMBC comics are. I also support others right to be upset or offended by the comic, since finding humor in personally horrific situations isn't something everyone can do (or are at a point to do so).

To the cis people who don't know what gender dysphoria is: It's horrific. It's also likely the best term for what Popeye is experiencing in the comic regarding his chest. Mine was thought to be severe depression for quite a while because I was too afraid of the reactions to my transitioning to take the steps I needed to in order to lessen my own suffering.
lunardreams
 

Re: [2014-04-07] I yam what I yam

Postby Dryditch » Mon Apr 14, 2014 4:42 pm

In all honesty, it is a bit of an over sensitive reaction to have to this comic. Popeye is supposed to be this figure of manliness and ruffianism in protection of his girlfriend. He's a character from a different Era, without the kind of cis/trans/gay awareness modernity has.

Having said the above, Popeye is distraught that he could be seen as something he is not. Hence:"I yam what I yam."
Dryditch
 

Re: [2014-04-07] I yam what I yam

Postby GUTCHUCKER » Mon Apr 14, 2014 10:32 pm

Toot toot!
Datanazush wrote:I ship Mohammed and Jehova.
User avatar
GUTCHUCKER
Gotchucker's less handsome twin
 
Posts: 2124
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 2:26 am
Location: Paradise City?

Re: [2014-04-07] I yam what I yam

Postby jake » Sat Apr 19, 2014 2:30 pm

It's worth noting that cis-people do deal with gender dysphoria all the time. The media is constantly barraging literally everyone with messages that they're not feminine/masculine enough and that they should buy this product or do this action to prove how feminine/masculine they are. No one actually feels like they conform to hegemonic masculinity/femininity and while cispeople can get a measure more respect from the average person as a member of their gender, it's a tenuous respect easily broken with a few small contradictions (she cut her hair and is wearing jeans?! What a dyke!) that have nothing to do with whether or not they would describe themselves as trans.
jake
 

Re: [2014-04-07] I yam what I yam

Postby Edminster » Sat Apr 19, 2014 3:13 pm

jake wrote:It's worth noting that cis-people do deal with gender dysphoria all the time. The media is constantly barraging literally everyone with messages that they're not feminine/masculine enough and that they should buy this product or do this action to prove how feminine/masculine they are. No one actually feels like they conform to hegemonic masculinity/femininity and while cispeople can get a measure more respect from the average person as a member of their gender, it's a tenuous respect easily broken with a few small contradictions (she cut her hair and is wearing jeans?! What a dyke!) that have nothing to do with whether or not they would describe themselves as trans.


Yeeess, in the sense that people who slice a finger open while cooking feel the same pain as people who are stabbed. Both are caused by sharp blades piercing skin (and both are painful and the world would be better if it never happened!) but the scale is way off.

I use these two scenarios specifically because among cis there is a largely voluntary element to the scene and if you are secure in your own self-conception and recognise the lies being pushed by marketers and regressives you have an absurd amount of lee-way before you are punished socially, medically, or economically.

This is not so with trans* people as simply existing in the body you were born in is a daily punishment and the best you can get with simple self-acceptance is 'welp i am stuck in this shitpile of flesh i hate, better make the most of it'. To go farther and attempt actual happiness often requires extensive psychological counseling and radical surgery which itself is not a guarantee of a restored self-image as there is always a little voice in the back of your head that says you are simply mimicking the outer form as a surgical abomination.

*this isn't anything it just feels sloppy to leave an asterisk un-footnoted
ol qwerty bastard wrote:bitcoin is backed by math, and math is intrinsically perfect and logically consistent always

gödel stop spreading fud
User avatar
Edminster
Tested positive for Space-AIDS
 
Posts: 8836
Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2005 9:53 pm
Location: Internet

PreviousNext

Return to Latest Comic Discussion 3: Revenge of the Son of Latest Comic Discussion 2

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests