Moderator: Kimra
zbbrox, The single-payer health insurance system will not be enough to solve all our problems. There are not enough doctors/ambulances/hospitals to cover those millions of people with actual health care even if they do technically get insured.
The claim in the comic is that it costs these people now $31,200 a year, which is $2600 a month, compared to the previous 13,000 a year, 1000 a month. For a 60k a year household that is half of their income. For a 90k a year household that would be a little more than a third.
The "shame, shame, shame" attitude is not helping anyone and I would like to find a helpful solution with a rational discussion.
zbbrox wrote:This is simply not true. Tens of millions of people have been brought into the health care market by the ACA so far, and we haven't seen healthcare shortages or dramatically increased lines. Canadia, the UK, France, etc. do just fine covering everyone despite the fact that they pay providers substantially less. And if you're really concerned about capacity, it's actually not that hard -- medical school costs are ludicrous and the associated debt scares talented people out of the business. We could reform that easily enough.
Racism originated not in ignorance and fear but as part of an enlightened enterprise of intellectual discovery.
-Dinesh D'Souza
In other words, a popular Auschwitz guard with a long marriage is the very definition of mental health. Moral considerations do not form the basis of mental health – a compliant Nazi is considered more ‘healthy’ than an outcast one. This form of ‘social ethics’ is largely due to the Jewish influence over psychology.
- Stefan Moyneux
Guest wrote:You cut off 50-30% of a small business owner's income and that might be 3-5 or 1-3 workers that they have to let go. Worse yet the business fails as a result and all their workers are without jobs. Apply that on a massive scale and that is tons of people without jobs, plus tons of business lost in general in the area that it affects. People will have to commute further/move away. Not even the mega-corporations can sustain a community.
Guest wrote:I wanted to talk about the working class, things are hard for them when they have to work overtime just to get by/ work 2-3 different part time jobs, but if they are let go/have difficulty finding jobs near their area at all, that is even worse. A person who LOSES their small business could find themselves in debt, have no other skills in demand in their area, and be pretty much downgraded to the working class in their older years, filling in even more unskilled labor jobs which we only need so much of.
Guest wrote:And it becomes a downward spiral where when that next young worker should have saved up enough money/ made a loan/ or otherwise reached a point where they would have started their own business later on in years and hired MORE workers, they don't.
Guest wrote:Lowering the cost to a fair rate is agreeable, I would prefer that to be achieved with free market competition and growth in the private sector.
Guest wrote:Always remember that no matter how you move around the numbers, healthcare never is "free". It costs a person's labor at the very least. To demand free labor is slavery.
Guest wrote:I don't have anything against any of you guys. A productive discussion/debate should just have different views.
Guest wrote:If we all agreed with the same things, and still have problems
Guest wrote:I would like to clarify that I would just like it if there ARE simply more hospitals/doctors to help those people, and not with inadequate care, and everyone capable of work should pay something or contribute something to have it, no one should have it for free, unless they are disabled/elderly/a child.
Guest wrote:Always remember that no matter how you move around the numbers, healthcare never is "free". It costs a person's labor at the very least. To demand free labor is slavery.
Guest wrote:When we pour more and more of our country's income into the government instead of growing the private sector, that government is going to decide where to purchase those resources from and what quality. I don't know about you but at least half of the government do not represent me at any one time. I am skeptical of trusting the government with too much money and therefore too much power. Those who are powerless will have no choice but to accept what they are given. With the private sector at least some of that purchasing power is in the hands of people.
Guest wrote:Some of those people worked hard, started out with less, but were responsible enough with their money and intelligent enough or talented enough to maintain a small business. That kind of person is a bit uncommon, most people just want to get by. I don't want to punish them, and you shouldn't want to either. To handicap them is to handicap the nation that allows so much potential in upward social mobility. That is part of the reason why we are free, but not all.
Marriage does not civilize men. Women do. This point is even evident in the gay community: It helps to explain why lesbians are generally much better than male homosexuals in sustaining long-term relationships. The reason that society privileges marriage and gives it a special legal status is because marriage is the only known incubator for the raising of children.
“If we could just get people to be nice to their babies for five years straight, that would be it for war, drug abuse, addiction, promiscuity, sexually transmitted diseases,” he said. “Almost all would be completely eliminated, because they all arise from dysfunctional early childhood experiences, which are all run by women.”
"Women who choose the assholes will fucking end this race. They will fucking end this human race if we don't start holding them a-fucking-countable. Women who choose assholes guarantee child abuse. Women who choose assholes guarantee criminality. Sociopathy. Politicians. All the cold-hearted jerks who run the world came out of the vaginas of women who married assholes, and I don't know how to make the world a better place without holding women accountable for choosing assholes! Your dad was an asshole because your mother chose him, because it works on so many women! If "asshole" wasn't a great reproductive strategy, it would have been gone long ago. Women keep that black bastard flame alive. They cup their hands around it. They protect it with their bodies...Keep fucking monsters, we get catastrophes, we get war, we get nuclear weapons, we get national debts, we get incarcerations and prison guards and all the other florid assholes who rule the world. Women worship at the feet of the devil and wonder why the world is evil."
Well a nazi guard with a long marriage fulfills those conditions, is he mentally healthy? No, that's ridiculous right?
Guest wrote:guest2, Yes, same person, and now I have to say that was extremely deceptively misquoted and taken out of context. Neither of them are racist, as you are trying to imply. They both were talking about other subjects at the time:
---
Dinesh D'Souza is Indian-American, that was from his 1995 book "The End of Racism":
"Is racism a Western idea? Yes. Contrary to popular impression, racism is not universal. Indeed there are no clear examples of racism anywhere in the world before the year 1500 AD. Racism arose in the West during the modern era as a rational and eventually scientific ideology to explain large differences in civilization development that could not be explained by environment. Thus, racism originated not in ignorance and fear but as part of an enlightened enterprise of intellectual discovery. The good news is that since racism had a beginning, it is conceivable that it may have an end."
https://books.google.com/books?id=QNV3X ... y.&f=false
Taken out of context it sounds like he is saying racism is a good thing.
Guest wrote:As for Stefan Molyneux, he
Guest2 wrote:I think it's time to admit your sources aren't nearly as credible as you think.
Guest2 wrote:And let's look at some more Molyneux quotes shall we?
--trimmed--
Guest wrote:Now you're acting like I am arguing against the concept of health insurance itself. I am not. Those people and the gap will be covered once affordable private insurance is available.
Look, as long as the amount of hospitals and doctors increase in the US, I will be satisfied. Right now we need some growth and innovation on that front and I truly believe that the free market can achieve that. We have been handicapped by strict regulations, high taxes, and many other changes put in the recent years.
Guest wrote:Look, as long as the amount of hospitals and doctors increase in the US, I will be satisfied.
Right now we need some growth and innovation on that front and I truly believe that the free market can achieve that. We have been handicapped by strict regulations, high taxes, and many other changes put in the recent years.
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